What training is required for FFZ?


Yes unimportant, because mostly it would be a ~constant


If to talk about rotor - then can say that mistake on rotor usually have bigger effect than when clock ball and at all we usually make bigger mistakes, when we clock rotor, because we not see some fixed point as ball. So, if we do click we can do or in the begining of number or in the end of number and not notice that.
One other moment is that most players thinks, that mistake in few pockets not make effect on result.

Really usually all determine only few pockets - you have advantage or not. That is because, if we will paint some chart and on pockets will write probability here to stop for ball we will see, how often higest probability and worst probability are in 4-6 pockets distance . And if we cover both we imidiately lost all advantage…



Thank you for your video, i will see your others videos, are very useful. OK, now I understand it.
The only doubt I have left is that the ball has not stopped yet when you stop stopwatch in second speed.
In 2 speed it seemed that it would fall in the number 8 but finally it was on number 30 after some rebounds

Should I stop the stopwatch without taking into account the rebounds that go to other numbers?

Example: Stop the chronometer when the ball crosses the first number from bottom to top

This small aspect could make the deceleration be 0 (NIL) or until 2 seconds


This is how i understand it step by step.

  1. You walk and sit down at the wheel with a good view.
  2. Then you wait for the ball to start spinning.
  3. Now you look at zero is above 12 a clock vertical deflector and start the stop watch timer.
  4. When the stop watch timer reach two second you look at what number is below vertical deflector at 12 a clock
  5. Now you notice the number and how many pocket difference there is between zero and your predicted number.
  6. Now you wait and watch the ball slow down and soon the ball will smack into any vertical deflector.
  7. Now you repeat the same process again and wait until zero is below vertical deflector at 12 a clock
  8. Then you start you stop watch timer and after two seconds you watch what number is below 12 a clock deflector
  9. If you get the same gap or amount of pocket difference when you compare both timings you have the same rotor speed and you don’t need to worry about RRS
  10. If you don’t get the same distance/gap or pocket difference then the rotor speed has change during the spin and the wheel has RRS



Hi @lucky_strike

Thank you for your steps, from point 9 and 10 I deduce that the only way there is to get the same pocket difference is if SAME reference number of previous count is showned

Example: If in Step 4 the reference number (after 2sec) was 30 then for confirm that this wheel dont have RSS should be show AGAIN number 30 in second count. Right?


Problems are that RRS can be not in every spin , so first what you must do is - measure many times…
And at all guys talk is how find if wheel decelerates normaly , or it have aditional engine is too funny. If player cant solve such problem himself - he have no chances in this fight… sorry, but such is reality…



I only wanted to show you how you can determine if it is a RRS-wheel or not.
This video shows only a possibility to measure the rotor speed without a prediction.
Please don’t misunderstand!


Thank you for your help @Donna_Amon.
Now I understand, it is more easy that I thinked. In you second count I am focusing when ball fall out and THE ONLY work to do is count AGAIN from 0 until 0 in last revolution.


  1. On the first revolution count from 0 to 0 and Note the time.
  2. On the last revolution to intuit when the ball will fall to a pocket and count again from 0 to 0

a) If time between first revolution count and last revolution time DOES NOT EXCEED 0,2 SEC THEN THIS ROULETTE IS NOT RSS AND IS ABLE TO CHEAT
b) If counted time between first and last revolutions IS HIGHER THAN 0,2 THEN THIS ROULETTE HAVE RRS AND IS NOT POSSIBLE TO CHEAT

Example: In your other video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UC7_D-Ffek8 HAVE NOT RRS according first spin (from 0:14 until 1:02) because first count was 2,52 and second count was 2,56

It is right?

  1. Yes! You should start to count as soon as possible because the first thing you do when you use VB or RC is to count the rotor. The sooner you know the rotor speed the more time you got to go for the rest of procedure.
  2. Yes! Always try to target the last 3 ball revolutions to count the second rotor speed.

This is a simple way to check the rotor speed to know if there’s a RRS-mechanism or not.
But you have to do it for some spins to only one, as Bebedictus said already, read this:

Also very important is waht Forester said:

Link: https://rouletteplace.com/t/what-training-is-required-for-ffz/1509/19

a) That’s right (but please note Forester’s post above - so you have to relativate)
b) Here the same - note Forester’s post

My wheel has no RRS-mechanics!

Most RRS are automated (no croupier) wheels with “Touch Bet Terminals” around the wheel


Detect if wheel have engine or not is maybe easiest part of all fight and about it even not worth to talk, because other fight is hundreeds or thousands times harder. And because it is harder - nobody even want to interest in that…yes that is true.

And not make prediction is hardest part. Prediction what we can make always is very uncertain thing - it can be right , but the same can be not right. To know how to win in such situation - here is what we need to know.
But this is every time other and other, one day something worked - next day not . Even half hour can be enough, that all will changed and all, what worked for us 30 minutes back, will not work…
Roulette is very unstable game… here is not Black Jack where is we counted that count is positive - we have mathematical advantage . Here we never sure - we have advantage or not…


Hi bebediktus

Note that these are my first questions about roulete computers, visual balistic etc. We all start without knowing anything as is normal, at least until you get familiar with the matter. If it is already hard for a native english then imagine me reading the bad english of Master True skill vb guide… :smile:

At my first moments I try to learn and understand logic, a lot of information and many doubts, example:

  • I am reading visual balistic from master true skill and i dont understand how get “visual key”
  • I even tried to understand the formula of forester (I could not understand the text in red) :
    (37/ second rotor count - 37/ first count ) / end first count until start second count = (9.41 - 9.84) / end fist count until start second count = -0.03 pockets/s^2

At least now understand how a roulette computer works (thank you Donna_Amon), it works with Visual balistic formulas preinstalled in chips: rotor speed (diagonal pin measurement) plus ball speed (2 or 3 revolutions measurement ball from pin reference)


Will it be enough counting from 0 to 0 on pin reference to use a Roulette computer or should I still know how to calculate the velocity of the ball?
Example: Counting 2 or 3 ball revolutions with Roulette computer after having counted the rotor speed


If you have bought Forester’s RC (FFV or FFZ), so you won’t need to count from zero to zero (only if you will). There is a half-rotor-clocking function available. In this case you can save time and go on to the ball measurement.

That’s correct!

I only described a way how to recognize a RRS-wheel, which is a part of VB. Counting the rotor speed is essential for each VB- or RC-player.


Measuring time is hard, same as pockets.
Movement of numbers against the frame is the easiest.

Using number zero is the easiest but any number can be used.


Number 23 is at start diamond


After reference time the number 23 passed by ~1 pocket diamond marked with blue arrow.

Earlier there was a vertical diamond 1/4 of turn.
After it there is also vertical diamond 1/2 of turn away.
The blue one I call 1/3 even it is not the 1/3 of the wheel.

In the next measurement I can start again with any number at start diamond and check if after the reference time it is again one pocket from the 1/3 diamond.

That way you don’t have to have a timer that must be triggered in particular time but the free running vibrating metronome can be used.

Same principle can be used to clock the rotor for visual prediction.

For example if the reference time is 2 s and you predicting ~10s to the end of spin.
The time multiplier would be 10/2=5

It is the easiest to compare differences.
One spin the rotor made 2 pockets after 1/3 diamond , next spin the rotor made 4 pockets after 1/3 diamond so the difference is 4-2=2 pockets. Then is expected that the rotor makes 2 pockets x 5 multiplier = 10 additional pockets than in the previous spin.


All is right, but you not think that all this is too elementar - we compare one way in reference time with other and proportionaly calculate left way. Not remember, but max 8th class in secondary school… :slight_smile:

In mine opinnion, who cant come to “how that do” himself, talks simply, that or peoples here come only to talk, or they cant understand elementar things.
In both cases, chances to be winners in this fight - are minimal…


Then i go for a drive about 4,000 km.

*Wish you all happy and successful New Year


I wish you all a happy New Year!