A couple VB2 questions


#1

Hi,

I’ve got a couple of questions on VB2?

  1. You say “Rotor speed that we mostly want to play is 4 sec per rotation”. Is that only to help us out and make it easier? If we couple accurately time the rotor speed and use it in the equation does it matter what speed the rotor is going?

  2. If I understand ACC is difference between ball timings? So as an example is this correct?..
    If we record the time of 2 revolutions by the ball, one after the other. And then take away the second (slower) from the first revolution timing, the number we are left with is the ACC?

  3. Using VB2 accurately what kind of advantage do we get, mathematically.

Also do you have any documents on your E2 system?

Thank you
Matthew


#2

The advantage that we have with any VB isn t about VB,but its about the conditions of the wheel.
Anyway the VB2 is the most accurate sollution when we have a wheel with DD and with rotor close to 4 secs per rev.
The reason is because with it even if we start the reference time 1 or 2 revs earlier or later the prediction will ne almost same.
Wile with VB 1 rev earlier prediction or after the resaults will be very bad.
I have tested the VB2 a lot and it take care of the 2 pins advantage very well too.

If the VB2 didn t have the limitation of the rotor speed then it would be the BEST VB ever and all the other VBs(traditional ones)would be out of work :smiley:

let me give u an idea of the VB2:
1stly I tested it in the video spins of Jafco wheel.
The rotor was almost in every spin 4 secs/rev.
The DDs were 12 are 3 ocklock.
With traditional VB when u were making prediction in the 4th rev and were hiting the 12 dd all was perfect.
If u were making prediction and the ball was making 3.25 revs then I was also accurate because the prediction number was also at the 3 dd.
But when I was making mistake and instead of 3.25 I was predicting the 4.25 the resaults were katastrofic.
with traditional VB the predictions of the 3,25(correct prediction) was 65% of the times.
Now with VB2 the prediction was at the 6th rev!!! and also I was taking advantage of the 3 ocklock pin 80% of the times!!!.

but what would happen if the dealer in the casino would see me wining so much?
he would change the rotor speed…and then what do we have??? we just can t use VB2 anymore there.


#3
Hello Matthew
1. You say "Rotor speed that we mostly want to play is 4 sec per rotation". Is that only to help us out and make it easier? If we couple accurately time the rotor speed and use it in the equation does it matter what speed the rotor is going?

I wouldn’t use equation, it is only mathematical explanation why system will work. In reality which reference time to use is found differently and on more practical way?

The easiest process how to define reference time is to apply it during same spin few times and check if result is close to same.

For example(ball CW) apply 1.5 sec , if predicted zero , instantly apply it again and get predicted 21.
21 is after zero it means in your reference time the ball did not slow down enough.
So try to apply 2 sec.
Since the system predicts equally in few rotations if time is OK then when you predict same spin 2 times you should get and same results.

It is not a must that rotor has to be 4 sec/r , it needs to be not to fast. What VB2 doesn’t like is significant change in rotor speed. If rotor is 10 pockets per sec and changes to 8p/s. We may clock it notice difference expect let’s say 10 sec. until ball drops and make adjustment of 2p/s x 10s =20 pockets but we may still have a problem. Because reference time was adjusted for 10p/s when we predicting in different rotations we get same predictions if rotor is 10p/s but with 8p/s it will start shifting by 2 pockets per sec. for each sec. we predict earlier or later then in usual. If we estimating when to predict with 5 sec accuracy (14 to 10 sec before then the ball drops) then we have 5 sec difference which can give us up to 5 x 2p/s = 10 pockets error.
We can say that after some practice we can estimate when the ball is at particular time to the end within 5 sec accuracy so if rotor changes 2 p/s w e adjust it and we accept some errors. More precised in guessing right moment when to start vb2 and we get less error. If rotor changes form 10 p/s to 6 or 16 that is a big difference and if we float 5 sec in our starting time error will be huge.

VB2 is just another way of predicting. I do not say more accurate but with timer used it is very easy way to play, all it does lets us predict within few rotations range and a bit earlier in time. Disadvantages are as explained by viper.

  1. If I understand ACC is difference between ball timings? So as an example is this correct?..
    If we record the time of 2 revolutions by the ball, one after the other. And then take away the second (slower) from the first revolution timing, the number we are left with is the ACC?

Yes

3. Using VB2 accurately what kind of advantage do we get, mathematically.

Same as with anything else, it all depends on the wheel you face and how you do it.

Also do you have any documents on your E2 system?
There should be in forums members section.

#4

Thanks for the speedy helpful responses guys!

So

If rotor is 10 pockets per sec and changes to 8p/s.
Is this during the same spin or between spins?

If I understand its during the same spin (as each new spin is a separate scenario).

So am I right in saying…as long as the rotor has a CONSTANT speed it will be fine, and that 4 seconds is the best time for the rotor speed to be constant?..So even if its time is 3 seconds, as long as each rotation is 3 seconds its fine? i.e as long as its constant

What I mean by our advantage is, what kind of strike right can we expect using it? 1 in 20? or…?

Also are there any good long videos that I can practise on?

Thanks again
Regards

Matthew


#5
Thanks for the speedy helpful responses guys!

So
Quote
If rotor is 10 pockets per sec and changes to 8p/s.
Is this during the same spin or between spins?

Different spin , rotor doesn’t change so much during the single spin.
You need to understand when we adjust reference time it is adjusted based on rotor speed.
All changes make us errors, but reasonable errors can be tolerated.

Yes, if you do test and rotor is 4 sec /rotation and you find out that reference time is about 2 sec then all spins with about 4 sec rotor are ok.

When you play first you apply same time (2 sec) to see how many pockets rotor will make.
In such case (4s) it will make half turn.
If next spin it is about half rotation, you know it is reasonably constant. + or - 4 pockets is ok.
But you still need to make adjustment, if rotor instead of 18 pockets made 20. It is 2 pockets extra in 2 sec , or 1 p/s . So if remaining time to the end is 12 sec , you need to make about 1p/s x 12s=12 pockets adjustment in ball direction.

(there is an different approach , it needs lot of practise and observation. If for reference time I count fast 1,2,3…10…11…15 if rotor is about 2 pockets faster I may count instead from 1-15 , 1 to 17 , two extra counts gives me about 12 pockets adjustment, it also reduces previously described error.)

[b] So am I right in saying........as long as the rotor has a CONSTANT speed it will be fine, and that 4 seconds is the best time for the rotor speed to be constant?.....So even if its time is 3 seconds, as long as each rotation is 3 seconds it's fine? i.e as long as its constant. [/b]
Exactly, for 3 sec reference time will be a bit longer.
What I mean by our advantage is, what kind of strike right can we expect using it? 1 in 20? or.......?

As with any advantage play, I take ffz I am predicting spins after some time I exactly know when system will predict, in usual I can detect 100ms difference in ball speed. I do it at home and I always have something to remind me about right moment. I can go to casino , keep same accuracy 10 min and next 10 I can lose it and start playing against myself. I am trying to say it is impossible to know. Wheel may be hitting diamond 4/10 it may be 8/10 which is much better. We in usual look how well we can predict where on rotor ball drops. If we can get it reasonable we assume that on long run we have advantage and we do if ball jumps are manageable.
Roulette is dynamic game, success also depends on our ability spot differences and adopt.
From systems point of view there is no reason to not predict every spin spot on, but reality is not as that. In reality even with computer is not easy, VB is few steps behind, so it needs easier conditions.

Also are there any good long videos that I can practise on?
Only what is published at forums..youtube. Most people here have dvds with video, if someone close to you can send you one.

#6

hello everyone

ı want to ask some questions about vb2 from my readings here.

1.how can we calculate ACC?Do we have to observe for particular ball rotation (the rotation where the biggest deceleration happens) and figure out the deceleration in ms?
Or simply pick up ampirically for few spins and observe whether is it working or not?
2.is ACC dependent on ball track properties?wheel type?spin style?material,mass,radius of ball?if all this are affecting do we have certain approaches all for this to figure out ACC?
3.which ball position do we have to start reference time?when the ball is above DD?or any place we want?
4.plz correct me ıf ım wrong:lets say ı applied 2 sc reference time.during the spin before the knee point come (when ball speed is for example 0.8 sc/r) when ball passed above DD ı started reference time.ı waited 2 sc.and ı read the number below the ball.then ı wait.when ball passes DD again ı start again reference time and after 2 sc ı read the number.if this two readings are same ım ın the correct way?is it how we get the drop point?

thanx very much best regards


#7
  1. Earlier with some models of FF we could read it but it is not the right way.
    Sure you can for example have video spins read times of ball rotations and calculate it but that is also what we do not use because there is very simple way.
    Since the VB2 claims to predict equally in any ball rotation (close range) you can simply pally reference time , read number then again apply the time and read the number. If the number is same it means the used reference time is good. So you applied time 2 times for example 2 sec each, and in between you may have 2 sec space it confirms you can get same number predicted if you apply the time during the spin where you made the test.

2.Sure ACC depends on many factors but in the case of VB2 you don’t need to know any of them.

  1. You can apply the time in any ball position, however the nmber you read after reference time is not the number on which ball may drop but it is a reference number equally distanced form the number where the ball drops. Assuming the rotor speed is constant. One spin you apply time read 0 the ball drops on opposite side number 5. Next spin you read number 5 and the ball drops on 0.
    Now you have 2 options , you can do the same and in the had change number to opposite side or you can simply apply the time 180deg form previous position.
    You can watch the video http://youtu.be/AzVB7jEA-wY
4.plz correct me ıf ım wrong:lets say ı applied 2 sc reference time.during the spin before the knee point come (when ball speed is for example 0.8 sc/r) when ball passed above DD ı started reference time.ı waited 2 sc.and ı read the number below the ball.then ı wait.when ball passes DD again ı start again reference time and after 2 sc ı read the number.if this two readings are same ım ın the correct way?is it how we get the drop point?

You only confirm that the reference time is ok because regardless in which ball rotation you predicted it gave you the same number.
Point of VB2 is to be able to predict within few ball rotations so if you make mistake 1-2 rotations you still get same prediction. VB2 doesn’t know rotor time so it doesn’t know on which number the ball will drop, but as earlier explained the number where the ball drops is distanced by same amount of pockets in each spin.


#8
Has there been any solution towards the issue with timer - as i understand it you need a timer to estimate correct. Does it work using a metronom with you mobile phone?

Cheers


It does work but it is a bit harder since the metronom can’t start at desired moment during the spin.

#9

thanx forester!
did you experience something like this:you applied 2 sec reference time and rotor speed is exactly 4 sec per rot.
you red same number.so reference time is ok.
then you observed drop point 6 pockets distanced.and like this you observed few spins.and everything is same(ı mean rotor speed 4sec, ref time 2 sc, prediction ok, drop point is 6 pocket distanced) and you decide to bet.now rotor speed is same exactly 4 sec, ref time 2 sec, you red same number so prediction ok you adjust 6 pockets.but you observe that drop point is now lets say 15 pocket distanced!!!
if you experience something like this what would you think why this happened?
is it because of ball didnt hit DD?
is it because of a big difference in ACC during the same spin?
or any other reason?

which issue luckystrike?


#10

It can happen many times if the ball goes for another DD.
Nothing you can do except expect that the ball will hit your expected diamond more often.

Another problem could be one that I experienced when i din.t understand the vb2 well enough so in earlier stages.
I played and profited something like 2k.
Then I start losing almost 2k.
I stopped and observed, I was predicting ok I wold win.
I continue playing and start losing again.
Reason for that was the dealer let me play late bets,
I believed I will be more accurate and slowly shifted prediction towards the end of spin.
With that I entered the spin after the knee zone and start getting inaccurate prediction.
When I stopped and checked, I was predicting few ball rotations earlier so everything looked ok.
On many wheels VB2 is not good to predict after 5-6 last ball rotations.
Theoretically is the best to predict always in one, but if most of the spins prediction is within 3-5 ball rotations it would still be ~perfect.
Another danger with VB2 is the reference time if the timer is not used. After some time the player can lose count then and predictions would shift.


#11

That is why one has to do 2-3 calculations and make sure you get the same number. If not. Do not play. (Not referring to the ball hitting another deflector)


#12
It can happen many times if the ball goes for another DD.
Here is main minus of VB2 that all game is based on fact that ball will hit to some and always the same diamond. If ball hits other diamond - prediction will not mach.

But for thinking peoples that is not big problem, not so hard is with similar way try to predict where ball will hit.

So to use time frame as indicator of ball speed. So all go in two steps - first we predict where ball will hit, then from this place we apply time frame for VB2 and then get real prediction. Of course first we need know wheel speed.

All that is like roulette computer only we do all with several time frames and many information keep in head.


#13

@ Bebedictus, so…as l understood, you sudgest to identify " place where ball hitt" befor apply vb2 time? Interesting… could you posibly populate the way to make it?


#14

I am sorry but I do not understand how you possibly can identify which deflector will hit. Please elaborate.


#15
I am sorry but I do not understand how you possibly can identify which deflector will hit. Please elaborate.
@ Bebedictus, so..as l understood, you sudgest to identify " place where ball hitt" befor apply vb2 time? Interesting... could you posibly populate the way to make it?

Y es here are some way which some players name as mine way of VB2 so it abit diferent way. All ideas is the same only i after choosing where to start time frameuse double time - double zaps one which show me where ball must hit other wich show me number, realy it is sort of RC program which is similar to say acrobat, but it we can have say easy with simple two zaps one of which represents place of where we must start main VB2 time…


#16

[quote=“bebediktus, post:15, topic:509”]

I am sorry but I do not understand how you possibly can identify which deflector will hit. Please elaborate.
@ Bebedictus, so..as l understood, you sudgest to identify " place where ball hitt" befor apply vb2 time? Interesting... could you posibly populate the way to make it?

Y es here are some way which some players name as mine way of VB2 so it abit diferent way. All ideas is the same only i after choosing where to start time frameuse double time - double zaps one which show me where ball must hit other wich show me number, realy it is sort of RC program which is similar to say acrobat, but it we can have say easy with simple two zaps one of which represents place of where we must start main VB2 time…[/quote] Do you mean double of normal vb2 time? And then apply double of vb2 time to identify number? Correct me if lm wrong.


#17

ım trying to understand the logic behind vb2 but there are some missing points inside my knowledge ı thınk.could you respond?
if ball deceleration loses linearity on the right side of the knee zone how could we be accurate with vb2?


#18
Do you mean double of normal vb2 time? And then apply double of vb2 time to identify number? Correct me if lm wrong.
No all is abit more dificult. Maine benefit of VB2 is that it is really very simple, but if ball hits to diferent diamond prognose - not works. So that is big damage , good if is big tilt, but if not - what to do - so i created mine own way of play in similar method with two signals , first where to start time . Second what will be number here in the end.

#19

[quote=“psikoanalist, post:17, topic:509”]ım trying to understand the logic behind vb2 but there are some missing points inside my knowledge ı thınk.could you respond?
if ball deceleration loses linearity on the right side of the knee zone how could we be accurate with vb2?[/quote]
Really you must separate two things - reliative prediction with VB2 and some natural prediction which point real result - that is two diferent things.
Forester simply found method with which we are not need to be in acurate ball round till end.
So from here is simple way of play, but how it is acurate is other question…


#20

When we talking about visual prediction we assume the wheel has a dominant diamond.
VB2 same as any other visual prediction predicts 1 or 2 dominant diamonds. Even if the advantage is achieved across 2 diamonds it is til predicted as one. What Bebedictus is talking is just a confusion, he is mixing roulette computers with visual prediction.
The only VB capable of predicting leveled wheel with more or less success is e2, still it can not define particular diamond where the ball will hit but it assumes all diamonds get same amount of hits.