Hello, vb2 is new for me and i want to learn and practice it, but there are some question that i want to do to understand it.
to play vb2:---- ( same conditions if i play tradicional visual ballistik are necesary?, like: a dominant diamond, i must to know the rotor velocity, and i need to observe a particular rotation, is that correct? )
If all of this is correct, then i can play with vb2.
step by step it would be something like that:
i observe a particular wheel, i observe if it have a dominant diamond , how often did it touch it, i observe the ball jumps to have an observation point. Is that correct?
Then for example i found a wheel with the 12 o clock dominant diamond , the ball touch it in the 60 % times, the ball jump is about 7 pockets, and the rotor velocity start in 3 seconds the spin.the rotor is clow wise.
With this dates i know that my observation point was at 3 o clock. is that correct??
which are the steps to do now in this example?
thank for your answer.
Then for example i found a wheel with the 12 o clock dominant diamond , the ball touch it in the 60 % times, the ball jump is about 7 pockets, and the rotor velocity start in 3 seconds the spin. The rotor is clow wise.
With this dates i know that my observation point was at 3 o clock. is that correct??
Your observation point can be any.
You adjust observation point according to results you getting.
The process of playing vb2 is same as playing any VB.
In brief,
Clock rotor like for 2 sec , when zero is at one diamond count your reference time and see how many pockets the rotor moves. For example ½ of rotation +3 pockets =21 pocket. All you need to remember is 3 pockets more than ½ of rotation.
Now let’s say you play traditional VB estimating and predicting 6th ball rotation before then the ball drops. If you do it precisely you know that after that the ball will travel remaining 5 rotations. When the ball travels constant amount of rotations it is also constant time, for example 8 seconds. You do not need to know is it 8 sec precisely but about.
When you identify particular ball rotation you read one number at any position on the wheel you want.
For example at 12 o clock D was number 0.
The ball spins 5 rotations and it hits 12 o clock diamond drops at number 5 jumps 20 pockets. (your average jump is 7 but we are adjusting).
From number 5 you look number 7 pockets far and it is number 31. So if the ball jumped as you expect it would stop there. Now you take your reference number form 6th rotation, “0” and compare it to number 9. It is 11 pockets in ACW direction from zero.
It means if in 6th rotation you were taking your reference number one pocket before 9 o’clock diamond you will be predicting right.
Next spin…
You do same but this time rotor makes ½ rotation + 5 pockets.
If you compare it to first spin which for now we take as a reference the rotor made 2 additional pockets.
½ +3 vs. ½ + 5
If in reference time of 2 sec the rotor made 2 additional pockets it means until the end of spin in remaining time of ~8 sec it will make 4 times more. Since your sample of 2 sec is 4 times smaller than remaining time of 8 sec.
So the difference of 2 pockets you multiply by 4, it gives you that the rotor will make 8 additional pockets until the ball drops at 12 o clock diamond.
When observing the ball trying to get particular ball rotation you shift your observation point from
9 o’clock -2 pocket to 9 o’clock -2 pocket plus 8 pockets (the ball is clock way direction) to make adjustment for rotor speed change. That would lead you to take reference number 3 pockets before 12’o clock diamond.
If everything else in the spin was the same but only rotor was a bit faster instead predicting number 31 you would predict number 35.
For example if rotor was making ½ + 6 pockets your position to read reference number will be at 12 o clock + 1 pocket.
So your main observation point is based on rotor making ½ + 3 pockets and it is at 9 o clock diamond -1 pocket.
I didn’t want to complicate it form start but is never too late.
Instead of using ½ +3 as a main rotor speed you can use ½ then observe form there.
In such case 3 pockets rotor speed difference is 12 pockets so for rotor speed of ½ rotation in 2 sec your main observation point shifts to somewhere to 5 o’ clock position. (-12 pockets)
From now on you look how many extra pockets the rotor makes from ½ of rotation.
If it makes same as in first example ½ +3 pockets , to 5 o’clock position you add 3x4 and you have an observation point at same place as in first example.
If rotor makes ½ and 5 pockets to 5 o clock position you add 20 pockets …etc.
If you predicted right and if ball jumps about 7 pockets you should be winning.
There are many ways how to adjust for difference in rotor speed but this is how I do it and I found it very simple.
VB2 is same just instead of guessing 6th ball rotation you apply vb2 to get an reference number then adjust accordingly based on process explained above.
How to define reference time for VB2?
Please read this section.
Thank you very much Forester.
I do visual ballistik in the form you describe,
And if i dont understand bad the method, in the case of vb 2 i read the number of any rotation, that gives me the same resultad.
Then i think: After i have a reference point, after, i know how many pockets extra makes the rotor in 2 seconds, i take any rotation and in 1,2 seconds i read the number under the ball, and it is my predicted number, after that i make the diference with the extra pockets and it will be my predicted number…Is that correct?
I want to contribute with how to time the 2 seconds, i am musician, and the thing i do is a base of drums : tupa tucu pa , tu pa tucu pa, very fast and it is 2 seconds aprox.it’s 1,85 to 2 seconds the most of the times.
1.2 s is only an example you found somewhere you should read how to define time for vb2 , also you do not have to use 2 sec for rotor can be same time as for ball bit then you have to use different multiplication for each pocket.
I understand that is a mathematic operation to know the time:
for example if i see: Acc is 6 and the spin of rotor is 3 , my time for vb2 is 1,5 seconds.And i can time the rotor 1/2 spin to know extra pockets, and i can too time the ball for my prediction. All with, in this case, 1,5 seconds. Is that correct?
No you do not understand!
ACC is never 6 but 200 range
But there are posts how to define reference time on a practical way without using the formula.
Formula calculation is only explanation why things work the way they do and also for people who had FFA which could tell them ACC.
Yes you can time the ball and rotor with same time.
To know if your time of 1.5 sec is correct Apply predict same spin 2 times.
Since the system says it can predict in few ball rotations it means you can apply your time
~12 rotations to the end and read number then quickly do it again and read number. The numbers should match or be close. If not your time is wrong. Readjust and repeat the process.
Hello Forester i have been reading all what you write about vb2, and i am learning it.
Could you put some general time parameters for: for example 4 seconds rotor, 3,5 seconds rotor,3 seconds rotor , 2,5 seconds rotor, and 2 seconds rotor , i know that 2 and 2,5 are not recommended, it is only to practice. Thank you very much.
Reference time depends on ball deceleration.
If you look video spins around you may find about 1.2 sec.
If you play in casino it is more like 1.8 sec for rotor 4-5 sec per rotation.
Nobody can tell you what to use.
The best is forget calculation it is only a mathematical prove that it works.
Try applying like 1.5 sec at 12 o clock diamond read number under the ball after 1.2 sec
Then instantly repeat the process again at 12 o clock and read the numbers.
If the time is right you should read same number.
If on second reading you read more in ball direction you need to increase the time.
For example first time you read 0 next time you read number 2 your reference time needs to be increased since after first reading zero during particular time the ball didn’t slow down enough to indicate zero again but it passed it and showed number 2.
If after first reading 0 on next reading you read 12 then you need to increase the time.
You do both reading during the same spin, and not to0 late when the ball is less than 5-6 rotations before drop…
Simple ;D
yes its cool to aplicate, i have proved it on spins videos on youtube and it really works, i apply on spins videos 1,2 aprox., sometimes 1,5.
if i take a time and it is not correct, it would be increase, if in the first rotation i read at 12 o clock for example number zero, and in the same time in other part of the rotation i dont read zero this time, i read number 5… my question is can i make a calculation to know my prediction in this case? i ask that because practicing i see that if the second number i read dont come to the first one, in this case number 0, and number 5 the second, maybe my prediction will be at 25 aprox, i see that .isonly a coincidence? thank you forester
If you apply VB2 2 times during the same spin and once you read zero and next time number 5 it means your reference time is very wrong or you were predicting to late during the spin.
No you can not calculate it since you do not know all required parameters.
But if ball makes 6-7 extra pockets you increase time by about 300-400ms.
Once you change your time you will be getting different results so readjusting offset is required.
Hello forester i applied first time vb2 in my casino , it works i won , but i need more attention, more velocity , and obviously more practice,i undestand that i can not play all the spins, it is better if i only play when i have security on my prediction, the wheel when i play yesterday , the 50% of the times the ball stops at number 4 and neighboards, so i conbined vb2 with this numbers, i have not win more because the jump of ball, and the dominant drop is not too dominant , so when i win too much i go home,but my prediction are correct, another thing that i note is when the dealer change changes all, and i have too see the spins without making bets.
Happy for you ;D
If you do right thing and if you have conditions you will win.
Dealer is only one who gives the force to the ball and who spins the wheel.
I do not believe his name or hair color has anything to do with how the ball spins :D.
The new dealer might spin rotor faster, for which you should adjust or if it is too fast you should avoid.
He may switch the ball, or have oily hands which might make ball sticky. Some people believe dealer may insert to much ball back spinning, I am not sure about it.
For example one thing that i have note is when dealer changes, the first dealer is very constant and is ball jump is aprox. constant too, 7,8,9,11 pockets clockwise direction, and the second dealer, the ball makes jumps for 18 pockets, or the ball make jump anti clockwise directions of 7 pockets and the rotor velocity was aprox. the same, because i only play when rotor is about 3, 3,5 or 4 seconds, if its faster i dont play and wait this time.
Hi all! For the last few weeks I am trying to learn and practice traditional VB and VB2.First,I did analize some spins on slow motion and
no doubts that both methods work.But my question is why VB2 is easier? In VB we trying to indentify exact revolution to the end of the spin.Ok,but with VB2 we should apply reference time TWICE during same spin to prove our time is correct! And main rule of VB2 says that ^VB2 can handle well if prediction is in wrong ball rotation or if rotor speed changes but not both of it.^So it means that if rotor speed changes we need indentify exact ball rotation same as in traditional VB.Only advantage of VB2(althogh big advantage)that in VB2 prediction is earlier.But earlier the spin harder to indentify same ball rotation.Of course,I read all threads of this forum,I saw many ppl agree that VB2 is easiest method.So I believe I just misunderstood something.Looking for help :)Thanks
Maybe it's not easier for you or maybe you missed something. Either way it is an alternative to traditional VB.
Ok,but with VB2 we should apply reference time TWICE during same spin to prove our time is correct!
Yes and No, it depends how you understood it. You apply it 2 times only at start to define which time to use. After that all you do is apply time once and get your number.
And main rule of VB2 says that ^VB2 can handle well if prediction is in wrong ball rotation or if rotor speed changes but not both of it. So it means that if rotor speed changes we need indentify exact ball rotation same as in traditional VB.
Not exactly as that. Errors are increasing but not so much.
If you deviate in your estimation of right ball revolution by let’s say 3 seconds (traditional VB it may be 4 ball revolutions) If rotor changing speed up to 2 pockets per second then your errors may be 0 to 6 pockets. It’s always (time you change in prediction) x ( rotor speed deviation).
So you may play rotor speeds 7.5 to 10 pockets per second (it is 3.7 - 5 seconds range), Your max error due to VB2 is (10-7.5) x 3 =7.5 pockets. Since you play in middle it means 3.75 pockets on each side. That’s extreme, when you are the most wrong in time & when rotor is the most different so it doesn’t happened often. Rotor 3.7 to 5 sec rotor is reasonably wide range. If traditional VB is wrong by 3 sec his error would be ~28 pockets and he has a huge problem of spotting the right moment during the spin, also rotor change for him makes an optical illusions so mistakes are common.
Only advantage of VB2(althogh big advantage)that in VB2 prediction is earlier.But earlier the spin harder to indentify same ball rotation.Of course,I read all threads of this forum,I saw many ppl agree that VB2 is easiest method.So I believe I just misunderstood something.Looking for help :)Thanks
Earlier prediction many times can be a condition that you can play. What’s the point of predicting 6 sec to the end of spin if you have no time to place bets. VB2 player can play more relaxed more covert with less wheel watching. Doesn’t need wheel with a knee point, so he can identify particular moment during the spin and VB2 player can be less skilled.
Often people come and claim they can always spot on right moment. There are some extremes but for most I honestly do not believe in it. The reason for it is myself. I tested thousands and thousands of spins. Imagine setting computer to predict in right moment during the spin. I clock ball rotations and wait until the system predicts. I could with 90% accuracy exactly know after which click the computer will predict. But I have all the time computer to remind me to be tuned for it. If I am in casino and playing traditional VB due to many factors tuning may be lost and get many wrong predictions. Then is hard to differentiate was it a wheel that caused ball to go longer that spin, or it was me that need to retune, but money is going away. For traditional VB is not guaranteed that you will guess it right most of the time.
VB player applies the VB2 time and the VB2 does hardest work.
Another issue with VB2 is accuracy of reference time. If you use a timer as FF has, then its accurate if you count the time than there is possibility of more errors. 100 ms wrong count adds additional 5 pockets error but then again 50 ms wrong count for traditional VB may lead him to predict full rotation wrong which could be 10-15 pockets or even more if prediction is later.
There is no point of discussing what’s better or easier. VB2 is there if you find it easy and useful you use it, if not then use what suits you. Of course either method you need to understand and try. 8)
Maybe it’s not easier for you or maybe you missed something. Either way it is an alternative to traditional VB.
Ok,but with VB2 we should apply reference time TWICE during same spin to prove our time is correct!
Yes and No, it depends how you understood it. You apply it 2 times only at start to define which time to use. After that all you do is apply time once and get your number.[/quote]
Thanks Forester! It’s much clearer now. But wanted to ask what it means only at start? At start of what? Of the beginning of the game session? For example,I came to the table,applying 2 sec twice in the same spin and see that time is OK.So I begin to play using this time?It means with this particular wheel 2 sec is OK?Or after a few spins I should re-check reference time again?Thanks again,Forester for your answers!
Yes you do it once, or few times at start, it’s the simplest way to confirm the time is ok but it’s also a prove that at times you predicting within few rotations the system works.
For example you started 2 sec time ~12 sec before the end of spin; then again at ~ 10 seconds. When you got same result no matter if you’ve predicted 12, 11,10 or 9 sec to the end you’ll get good results.
If you want you can apply it 5 times during the spin to see how results match :D.
But when you play try to do it at same moment as much as you can to avoid errors I was explaining.
Once you confident in applying the time and wheel you’ll understand why is so simple to play.