# Is beateable this wheel?

Hello i want your opinions about that, because at that point i dont know.
I am talking about an electrochance ( company electrochance)roulette with air compressed ball .
I must to play before the game starts.The nmb is called after my bets, and the game starts at this point.
With this information is totally unbeatable, but it has others interesting points.
The rotor start to moving from 0 to 1,9 seconds , and in the second spin to the end the rotor has 1,9 constant speed, the ball enter to the game between the 2-3 rotor spin.The ball enter at 2 or 2 1/4 or 2 1/2, or 2 3/4 or 3erd rotor spin.It doesnt follow a pattern, but i can see that the most of the time it doesnt change more than 1/2 , for example game1 the ball enters at 2,25, and the second game the ball will enter at 1,75,2,2,25,250,or 2,75 of rotors travel. The ball has a speed at start of 0,9 seconds the first 3 spins , and then it desacelerates 0,20 seconds per spin.
The ball falls always between the 11-12 rotor spin.
It has a Dominant D. at 3 hours , it is about 60 of the times,and the ball fall 8 pockets from the moment it has contact with DD, other 25 of the times the ball stop between the 1 and 12 hours diamonds.And the other 15% the ball comes between 11 hs and 6 hs , and maybe it makes rolling or maybe has 6-15 pockets.
Allways the ball goes anticlockwise and the rotor clockwise.
The wheel has no maintenance, it as a glass ceiling, and it works 24 hs.
The ball hasnt rolling most of the time.
I want your opinions and if another member plays this kind of wheels.thank you very much

Dealer Signature.

Yes davey , but how do you play it in that case with all these information?And how do you solucioned the theme that i dont know when the ball will come to play.

That information is irrelevant to me. I would have to be there personally to observe the wheel to know if I could beat it or not. The question is whether or not you can beat it or not.

I would suggest that you observe the rotor speeds, release numbers, and final numbers. Look for any consistencies and correlations that may come up. If the wheel appears beatable, then you just need to figure out how to get a good idea what the release number is going to be.

Good luck.

The wheel has compressed air that is fired out of tiny ports in the ball deflectors towards the end of the spin to help randomize the spin.

Lots of moving parts means: It’s still worth measuring, since the machine could be malfunctioning. Exploit the inefficiencies where you can find them.

-Snowman

[quote=“Davey-Jones, post:4, topic:899”]That information is irrelevant to me. I would have to be there personally to observe the wheel to know if I could beat it or not. The question is whether or not you can beat it or not.

I would suggest that you observe the rotor speeds, release numbers, and final numbers. Look for any consistencies and correlations that may come up. If the wheel appears beatable, then you just need to figure out how to get a good idea what the release number is going to be.

Good luck.[/quote]
Nicoramone, do what Dave said, he knows what he says.

[quote=“Snowman, post:5, topic:899”]The wheel has compressed air that is fired out of tiny ports in the ball deflectors towards the end of the spin to help randomize the spin.

Lots of moving parts means: It’s still worth measuring, since the machine could be malfunctioning. Exploit the inefficiencies where you can find them.

-Snowman[/quote]
The ball is fired from a hole by air pressure. The machine trends to do it as regular as possible.
Rotor often goes the same speed. The differences in half a second from spin to spin is due of malfultioning.
The machine Nicoramone meant do not have this randomizing device.
Very few people has taken notice to air ball machines

Snowman: Like toby says it hasnt this device for deflectors , it only shot the ball with air compressed, and it have only one heavy ball.
I have thumper it and its very consistent, it average speed at first 3 spins is 0,9 seconds, and it desacelerates 0,2 per spin always and always it fall between the 11th-12th rotor spin.Snow a question: if you know the ball always fall to rotor in the same place, you know the speeds and they are constant, but you hasnt sd on the outcomes numbers, what is your recommendation.
Toby: Yes, you are right,
Davey: Yes, i must to search coincidences.
If we know a wheel has a defect, the ball always , all the time fall within the 3 and 12 hours, without visual balistic,how do you play it?
I have make a mapp for me from when starts the 11th rotor spin to end where the ball , and where the ball will be, it is esenciall to know the exactly moment when the ball comes to play.I have make a mapp for all the deflectors jumps.
If i know that it will be a visual ballistic play, because i know all the others elements, but without this information it is random.
I must to predict the change on the compressed shot, i doesnt know how works it , only i know is that it change without a pattern and the change are from 1/4 rotor spin, from 2 to 3.

The rotor start to moving from 0 to 1,9 seconds , and in the second spin to the end the rotor has 1,9 constant speed, the ball enter to the game between the 2-3 rotor spin.
Difference in between 2-3 rotor rotation is 1 full rotor rotation or 37 pockets it means the ball can start spinning at any number regardless which one was at the start. making random results regardless if the ball travels all the time same distance.

You need to place bets earlier so the DS can’t be applicable.
Even if instead 2 to 3 rotations it is 2 or 3 rotations you wouldn’t be able to play it since you have to place bets before then the rotor starts and you wouldn’t know at which number the rotor will start.

Yes forester i noted that , and i am searching a form to predict or determine this changes from 2 to 3 when ball comes to play,
For example if i have do my good calculations,
A- the ball start at number zero at 12 hs and the ball enter to play at 12 on the second rotors spin, The rotor speed is constant 1,9 , the first 3 ball speeds are 0,9, and then it desacelerates 0,2 to the end .
If the ball falls at first of the 11 rotor spin it will be at second diamond and with a distance when it touch a diamond and fall of 6 pockets , my prediction will be maybe number 3 if it touch 1hs diamond the predictic will be at 29 , if it touch 12 diamond my prediction will be at 20 , and if the ball touch 3 diamond my prediction will be at number 2.
Now another game the ball waits 2,5 rotor spin to enter , but in my mappings the ball will fall only on a half of the wheel can that be correct? or i have make an error in estimations? from 0 ,17,11,24 with ball entering at 2,5 rotor spins it can falls in this only half, with the other constant elements, or have i made an error? thanks forester

If you do not have a reference on release of the ball you cannot play ds. What I mean if you still had time yo place when the ball is released you can use ds. When the ball is released and passes your dd, look at what number is under the dd. Wait for result and use this distance for future predictions. You coud play whatever your prediction is and also directly opposite a 5 number sector. If you have to place before the ball is released, I cannot see how you could beat it.

Off course if the wheel was stationary and you picked a ref point before it starts AND the ball is always released at exactly the same time it is possible. But then you have to have a perfect consistant startup everytime. Like, 0 is at 12’0 Clock, 0 is your ref… The wheels starts up and does exactly 3 revs and ball is released. That means 0 is still in the same place. Say wheel did 2.5 revs, the 5 would become your ref. Something in that direction I would look at.

Off course if the wheel was stationary and you picked a ref point before it starts AND the ball is always released at exactly the same time it is possible. But then you have to have a perfect consistant startup everytime. Like, 0 is at 12’0 Clock, 0 is your ref… The wheels starts up and does exactly 3 revs and ball is released. That means 0 is still in the same place. Say wheel did 2.5 revs, the 5 would become your ref. Something in that direction I would look at.

Yes toxic , the wheel makes that, but i cant take advantage

But you place your bets even before then rotor starts.

It is possible to play DS prior to the release if you can guess where the release is likely to be. For example, a dealer likes to pick up and release right away, so you can pretty much use the last number as a release point. Or say he likes to hold on for 3 seconds, but it is a consistent 3 seconds, so you have to know how far the wheel is going to move in 3 seconds. It’s not going to be as accurate, but it is something. Then you would check the release number to see if it is right.

What I was merely suggesting is that he look at the wheel and track it like he could bet after the release number. Let’s assume that the machine exhibits a perfect dealer signature (unlikely). Then all he has to do is see if there is a way that he can predict the release number before it happens. Does it release at 2.5 seconds after nmb’s? or 3? Or at random times? This is a machine we are talking about. If it was consistent, then is should be super consistent. If it is randomized, then it should be more random than a person. Does it sector shoot? These are all things to consider.

Let assume the wheel is stopped with 0 under 12 o’clock. It starts spinning and say takes 3 seconds to power up to a 2 second rotor speed. After that it is a consistent 2 second rotor. Conveniently, the release happens at 3 seconds from the rotors first movement. So the ball releases over the zero at 12 o’clock. By the way, we are in fantasyland right here assuming that it would be this easy, but just think of the example. We would then be able to predict a likely release number from a fixed position on the wheel before the spin begins.

Perhaps there are 5 different rotor speeds, but the release happens at exactly 3 seconds. But you don’t know what speed to pick? Maybe there is a overlap with the 5 different DS predictions. Maybe it’s enough to negate the house edge. Maybe there are 5 different release times too. Now there is DEFINITELY and overlap. Maybe there is enough to convince you to favour one octant, quarter, or half of the wheel. Or maybe it is spread all over the wheel. Who knows? The point is, if you want to beat the thing, you have to get out there and collect good data on it and be sure it is beatable. Don’t be like everyone else and say “Hey guys, there is a wheel in my casino. Is it beatable?” Go out there and find the hell out! If you think it is beatable, BE DAMN SURE you are right. It’s easy to make one mistake and lose your entire BR in this business because you thought you were right, just ask (insert any forum member here).

Personally, I don’t trust the automated wheels. But if you are going to try and beat them, you need to get as detailed as you can in your data collection. Make sure the wheel is tilted first, before you spend hours tracking it.

Edit: Sorry if this was kind of repeating what was already spoken of in this thread. I tend to read them fast, then get distracted and forget what was posted. Save the jokes about me being a woman!