Has anyone bought Jafco's system?


#141
YOU are the one making assumptions without knowing anything.

I talk to John and that put an end to it for me.
Now you can say what ever you want.

I just hope that you try to stay with the truth and not making assumptions about things you know so littel about.

Cheers LS


#142

What are you waiting for to purchase his 2,000£ PDA then, you who is so convinced the guy has nothing to do with Mark just because you talked to him. What a chance scammers have to meet such naive and uneducated people…
I’m sure Stefano’s 1h demo on his 15 years old Huxley convinced you he is not a scammer because he won at the end of the session, right?. Stop wasting my time, and go back playing with even chances.


#143

Ill copy few posts from around in here…

The Vibe method stand out as unique as very few systems in the world are able to play this two pin game.

Jafco wrote about his system that is it unique as no other system because it can predict 2 pins.
He wrote it predicts 2 pins but he never explain why only his system predicts that.

All he teaches you is watch the ball and estimate when it is 3 rotations before it drops.
For 2 pin game is same, watch the ball and estimate when it is 3 rotations before it drops.

So where is the difference?

There is none, and there is nothing else needed to do to be able to play 2 pin game.

So how can 2 pin game relate to his system VIBE?

It can’t because it relates to any tilted wheel with reasonable rotor speed.
Vibe he uses only to time the rotor to se if it see going faster or slower.
With his system there is no process of defining particular ball revolution which is a main task of any visual prediction.

On every wheel if we make prediction and if the ball makes ¾ of rotations less then we predicted, (different diamond hit) there is a good chance that the rotor may be in that position.

For that to be close to perfect, we need rotor speed of about 6 pockets / second.
If it is 9 p/s is not a big deal since to have prediction with 3 pockets extra error isn’t much. But do not forget with such slow rotor even if prediction is wrong by one rotations error is not high and you will still have good results, (even with estimation).

The only difference that Jafco recommends for two pin game is to select first pin (in ball direction) from two dominant pins.

That doesn’t create effect of 2 pin game, but by explanation it looks as without it, it wouldn’t exist.

It would. It always exists on tilted wheel.

I come across a post from Kelly.
Even he has problem understanding, sadly he uses my name to explain something that he doesn’t understand.

"Jafco also gives you a soloution for a 2 and 3 pin game. Forester will tell you thats it WRONG EXPLANATION because you should pick dominant pin. Jafco is talking about 2 pins with 50/50 distribution. If one of the 2 for example the second pin is dominant, the analyse will pretty soon tell you wether its closer to a 1 pin game with the second pin as dominant rather than a 2 pin game. Dont mix oranges and apples. "
Is not truth that Jafcos is talking about 50% distribution.

He clearly stated that you have to always use first pin.
“Never aim at 2nd pin”

He also stated to use it even if the other pin is getting more hits.

It looks as both of them think 2 pin game will disappear if you aim to pin 2, that you will actually switch to pin 1 game and be able to take advantage of only one pin (diamond).

It is not correct. Two pin game still exists, it is always there if the wheel is tilted and if the ball is hitting 2 DD.

Player with good understanding would chose to play with the highest advantage as i explained earlier. Having 80% of good predictions by selecting second pin instead of first one (50%) makes a big difference.

How well we can estimate particular ball rotation?

Good estimation of particular ball rotation is the most important to play Jafcos system,
because he doesn’t have any process to help the player in defining particular ball rotation.

It is really individual thing it also depends on kind of wheel we play.

I may be one of people who tried to estimate it more then any other person in the world. When testing FFZ which always predicts in particular ball revolution, I developed very good skill in estimating when the system will predict. For example I may set the system to predict as soon as the ball is 1.2 sec.
After some time I could reasonably well know when the system will predict.
But that is when in every spin all the time get refreshment of right ball speed.
If I try to do it in casino without using timer to clock the ball, it wouldn’t be so good. I may deviate in estimation even 3 rotations.
On most casino wheels (Jafcos wheels are different) after passing knee point the ball slows down with deceleration. There is less friction and also ball slightly drops down so diameter on which ball is spinning is reduced. So the ball deceleration may drop to 100ms per rotation.
To estimate ball speed within 100 ms is very hard.
Even if we estimate reasonably well there are 3 things that could happen on 2 pin game.
1 -the ball precisely hits DD1
2-the ball hits DD2
3-the ball makes different amount of rotations.

With one everything is clear. But with 2 there is something interesting that I would like to highlight. If the ball to the end makes ¾ rotation less and if rotor is slow we are close with result and we can say we taking advantage of DD2. But the ball can make and ¼ of rotation extra and still hit DD2. in such case result will be bad. For ball to make to next diamond it may be less difference in speed then the ball that makes ¾ less. But we can look it as equal chance. You never see it on Jafcos video, so can he really estimate ball speed with accuracy of about 20 ms per rotation or he simply made good looking videos for marketing. Same applies to ball that dropped ¾ shorter, with only few ms difference in speed it could drop and 4/4 shorter (different rotation).
You also never see it on his video.

No matter how positive I want to be I still couldn’t figure out what Jafco system really is.

If people could just estimate ball speed there would never exist visual prediction methods, or even roulette computers.

I see it only as a nicely presented explanation of tilted wheel principles for beginners with small misunderstandings in it.

Perhaps if you come across similar wheel as Jafcos and if the rotor is so slow then you may find it useful. If rotor is only 6 pockets per sec. and if you estimate ball speed within 3 sec. time frame during the spin, you only deviate 3x6=18 pockets. With low ball scatter you can make nice wins with it.


#144

Forester,

Although I’m new on this forum, I’ve been involved with gambling one way or another way before most of you were born and was banned throughout the UK for my BJ play in the early 80’s. I was also involved with a very good VB player in the US in the early 90s. I now make my living from Betfair using automated software I have designed. That was just a note so you understand I’m not a newbie.

What saddens me a great deal about all the roulette sites based around VB or computer tracking is how 80% of the time they attempt to discredit their competitors, create rumours, make snyde comments and generally act extremely defensively. In my mind this doesn’t create a good impression about any of the products they are trying to market. Do you find the Toyota marketing department slagging off Renault, Versace trying to discredit Chanel ? I don’t think so.

This defensive stance can lead to a couple of conclusions. First, it implies their own product may not be exactly what it appears and can’t stand on its own feet, the people behind the products are simply too immature to understand how they appear to those they are selling to and/or they are desperate for the income because they can’t use their own products in the real world.

So, I’d like to suggest that you for one stop this childish behaviour because you don’t create a credible impression if you continue in this fashion. I like what your products appear to be but you’ve simply put me off buying any of them by the way you conduct your business. Your defensive approach is probably putting off as many as you’re encouraging. And I’m really surprised that someone who implies the level of intelligence that you do, hasn’t grasped this already.

You need to let some stuff just go over your head and rise above your competitor’s constant bickering. If your products do what they’re supposed to do, let them speak for themselves. Use positive testimonials, be magnanimous when talking about your competitors, teach them, offer suggestions and generally appear to be less defensive in your approach. I think you’ll find it will work to your advantage.
Anyway, that’s my sixpenneth but I’m sure many others have come to a similar conclusion.


#145
What saddens me a great deal about all the roulette sites based around VB or computer tracking is how 80% of the time they attempt to discredit their competitors, create rumours, make snyde comments and generally act extremely defensively. In my mind this doesn't create a good impression about any of the products they are trying to market. Do you find the Toyota marketing department slagging off Renault, Versace trying to discredit Chanel ? I don't think so.
It was Stefano who discredit everyone. He is one who created all web bags pretending do be someone else. At start he mainly discredited Mark Howe.

Later one Mark made few similar sites.

I did not, I just run forum and let people talk.
If that brings more customers or not I completely do not care.

Here you have many people who have different products and they share experiences.
Maybe I am only lucky that none of them complained about me.

If you think that i do discredit Jafco, I do not, I just highlight my opinion, because I know that he missed one part. Until now I did not meet single person who have made serious money with VB just by watching the ball and estimating how many rotations it will turn. Sure you can do it if rotor doesn’t move or if it very very slow.


#146

OK. Well lets move on. I need your advice. I’ve worked with a good VBer back in the 90s who had about a 20% edge but he needed the deep fretted Huxley wheels for his system to work. Since then I’ve lost contact with him but I do know that VB can work.
Personally I’m looking to work with a good system in Europe that will be able to be used with (ideally) non-tilted wheels. I’d prefer to use VB if possible but if not, then a reliable discreet computer.
What system would you advise me to use and/or buy ?


#147

You said LEVELED wheel!
The only one ever created VB (known to me) that can make slight advantage on leveled wheel was my E2 system. I did not use it for more then 3 years since as you said, wheels have changed.

I do not teach anybody VB. I only opened section on forum to discuss how I play VB.
It was mostly for FF users but later on I let and the others to subscribe.

FF is the only one computer that can handle real leveled wheel.
It’s not jut a matter of proper algorithms but hardware which is more then 1000 time faster in processing information compared to programs where Java is used.


#148

After my last post I decided to buy the Jafco CD and DVD system and I spent a couple of weeks going through them and practising. The system is fairly intuitive and I grasped the logic behind it readily. As the days wore on I seemed to improve in my ability to call the numbers and so I decided to take the next step and book some one on one tuition with Jafco.

I live not too far from his base in the UK and spent 6 hours with him yesterday. I instantly warmed to him, liked his style and he taught me a number of things that were not on the CD or DVD. These new elements were quite alarming and I haven’t seen them mentioned anywhere else but I can see how they could have a significant effect on ones longterm profitability. In my opinion it was 6 hours very well spent and I now understand much better the 2-pin overlaps that his system uses.

Now I’m sure there are many VB systems out there that will work equally as well but for me at least this one fits well into my own style. More importantly in many ways, I think I have now made contact with a gentleman who has ‘been there, done that’ and who I will be able to use as a mentor while I get to grips with real world wheels.


#149

While Jafco teaching people VB for $300 (6 hours), other people fly thousand km. to Ritz casino which is in front of yours and Jafcos nose and take thousand times more in one day. That casino must be having really good wheels. ;D
I am not a VB expert as some of my friends are, but still do not believe that just watching ball and estimating that it’s at particular speed is good enough to take advantage in real casino conditions.
Keep practising…


#150

Well think again because we took $32,000 in just a few hours from The Maxim and Sahara a few years ago when a friend of mine used his VB skills doing just that.

There is no doubt that computers will be better and be able to take advantage of a wider range of situations but that doesn’t mean to say under the right conditions VB can’t be a substantial winner in the right hands (or right eyes !!)


#151

Maxim and Sahara must have preety easy wheels to let u do that ;D


#152

Hi everyone

I’m new to this forum but have been reading for a while. I myself also one of Jafco’s customers (his VB not the RC.) I’m not here to try to protect or attack anyone. I just want to confirm that Jafco is really a gentlemen and his after sale service is second to none.

Believe it or not once, i talked to him about his RC and said that i would like to get one but i’m not in a financial position to afford it at the moment. He even told me that i should contact forester for the RC because he knows that i live in Australia !!

The only thing that i regret is that i wish i live in the same country as him because he also want me to visit him for more tuition.


#153

Easy. Hard. Its all relative


#154

Juli art

I am also a customer of Jafcos VB method…

all of his customers know that he is a true Jentelman…Noone will tell u the oposite here. :slight_smile:

I also like him a lot!

I am also a customer of Forester …so as i can tell u that Jafcos VB works…I can also tell u that FFA works too


#155

Doris
If u think that easy and hard wheels is relative then Go and play only in hard wheels and tell me the resaults…

hahahhaha


#156

Gentleman or not it has nothing to do with winning at roulette.
Also nobody is comparing roulette computer with VB here.
Of course that precised measurement increase accuracy, but also is truth that VB is legal while RC’s are not. Under right conditions player can win more with VB then with computer even if it may take 5 times longer.

Since people discovered tilted wheel effect, they tried to develop methods how to identify particular ball revolution. Reason for that is because they couldn’t just estimate it.

That is why today we have known methods such as cross patterns, using only parts of rotor, counting time, timers…etc.
Jafco has method of using a timer to observe rotor movement in particular time frame so the player can make adjustments for faster or slower rotor. Most people do it one or the other way.

Jafco explains effect of tilted wheel but until now he did not find a method which could help player to identify particular ball revolution which is essential for roulette visual prediction.

Sure it is not important if rotor doesn’t move at all. No matter in which rotation you read rotor reference number it will be always same. You really test quality of VB with increased rotor speed because then mistakes are more visible.

Spin the rotor 2 sec per rev, then try to estimate and you will clearly see mistakes. Then you will discover that even if you have same amount of rotations to the end that you still can have prediction wrong by ~18 pockets.

It is a good start and it may open eyes to many people what advantage play is, but by my opinion Jafco’s VB is not a solution.

Perhaps someone can explain to me what is so special in the system that i did not notice.
This is how i see it.:
1)Rotor check, …same as anybody else, he has to make card for every particular wheel ball combination, the others do not. Cards are less practical but it may help unexperienced player.

2)The ball, the others define ball rotation, Jafco only estimates it.

3) 2-3 pin game, nothing to do with estimating ball or with Jafcos rotor timing, it is an effect created on tilted wheel with adequate slow rotor speed. By my understanding even wrongly explained.

4) Overlapping wrong prediction with ball scatter pick points, (not explained by Jafco)…

Also i do not understand which skilled advantage player and for which money wouldn’t mind to show his face and spend 6 hours with anybody who wants to see him. If stranger asks me and pays me $5000 just to have a coffee with him and talk about roulette I would refuse. I can’t even imagine bringing someone to comfort of my home to show him how FF works. Some VB players even changed name to be able to play at some places.


#157

You really are a small minded, mealy mouthed individual, besides being totally incomprehensible at times. Your last paragraph makes no sense whatsoever. Did you use Google translator by any chance because its total gobbledegook ?
The simple matter is is that roulette can be beaten using numerous methods and for some strange reason you have such an ungenerous spirit you won’t accept any other methods as being valid other than your own.
Frankly I think your negativity sucks and although I had at one time thought of buying FFZ, I’ve decided to give your site and forum a wide berth from now on (stick that in Google translator) and I certainly won’t be buying anything from you.
We’re all looking to find an edge and rather than the co-operation I found when trying to beat blackjack back in the 70’s and 80s, I find the roulette community obsessed by egos and point scoring.
Life really is too short to deal with people like you, so I’m off.
Give your wife my condolences…


#158

What is going on here? What it looks like to me is someone under multiple names. I might be wrong but it looks like that.

About vb I dont think there would be any way ever to beat a level wheel with vb. You would have enough trouble doing it with a computer. Doris if you really did do $30k winnings I think it would have been a fluke. I dont believe it though no offense people just dont brag about that stuff.

I dont know jafco I do hear both good and bad things about him. I hear good and bad things about the others also. I figured the only way to know the truth is to buy at least whatever seems most credible. I just got faa and so far so good but I havent learned all things yet.

There is so much hostility in roulette forums and between sellers. Doris if you are jafco just chill because if you are legit your customers are all that matters.


#159

What is your last paragraph means forester?

Suppose if i want to buy your RC can I arrange for a live demonstration before i buy?
1900$ is not a little money so, I may need to see the product in live action before i can make a decision.


#160

Doris , did i in any way say that nobody can win with VB or without FF.
All i said is what is missing with Jafco’s system. You like it or not it is a fact.
For you it may be something new to read, for me it is only basic.

Can you tell me one process in his system that is better then for example UWE system ort LS system in helping player to identify particular ball revolution?

If you can then you may be right, but i didn’t see any. Can you separate any sentence in my text and say it is wrong? (excluding English mistakes, since it looks that is the only one where you can find me wrong for your argument)

Get real JuliArt, I do not sell my face to anybody and I do not even show pictures of FF. My objective was never product marketing at any cost.
I do not need to invite people to my home to convince them in anything. It is your choice, you can buy FF but you can’t buy me and my personal time. Apparently Stefano and Mark are doing it, it looks as Jafco as well. I do not think that Lurance would do it, maybe we just have different personality or different priorities. I sell FF as it is, it will produce better advantage then any VB, it will even predict levelled wheel, but i really have no time for peoples experiments.

You read this site, you observe your wheels, if you believe you can put this 2 together you get it if not who cares.
I did not come to net with webpage, hey guys i am an expert this is miracle you will just win.
I come up with E2 which was free, i only charged few $ to make electronics circuit.
Some of units i even supplied for free for testing.
FF come as a result of people who were contributing, we were learning together.
All the others introduced themself to public as experts, somehow they have great system but for some reason they need to sell it. In usual provided information is misleading, and deceiving.

I am trying to tell you reality. But sometimes is hard same as when i listen 2 of my friends talking.
Ivan caught catfish that tail was hanging down from 8 T Anto’s track. Now you try to figure out, is the fish really so big, or the track was too small or they both were drunk.

About vb I dont think there would be any way ever to beat a level wheel with vb. You would have enough trouble doing it with a computer.

I like this sentence.